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Option for formulas to ignore excluded rows

I would like to see an option for formulas to ignore excluded rows without having to build this into the formula using the "exclude state" formula function.  I think the easiet way for this to be implemented is to have it as a column property option in the formula column property option box

shampton82_0-1670599787726.png

So just one more check box here that would say "treat excluded rows as missing"

 

Thanks for considering this request.

 

Steve

8 Comments
Status changed to: Acknowledged

Hi @shampton82, thank you for your suggestion! We have captured your request and will take it under consideration.

Status changed to: Investigating
 
Status changed to: Needs Info

Hello @shampton82. Thank you for the request! I am hoping you can provide some example use cases of when this feature would be helpful? 

 

shampton82
Level VII

Yeah, here is an example.  Lets say in the Titanic example data set I make this formula.

shampton82_0-1671222761133.png

 

and I am looking at this chart

 

shampton82_1-1671222804117.png

I decide that I have a bunch of data that isn't useful in this analysis and is skewing the mean so I exclude it.  The chart changes but my calculated value did not in the formula and thus the mean dots and the caption box summary statistic did not change:

shampton82_2-1671222861775.png

 

So in this case I would want the formula to treat the excluded rows as missing because the excluded data is not useful in this analysis.  However, I may want to keep it for another analysis and thus recoding it to missing is not a great option either.

 

My work around has been doing something like this

shampton82_3-1671223072675.png

but it has not always been this straight forward.

 

Hope this helps!

 

Steve

 

hogi
Level XI

I fear, for more complex formulas, it will not be 100% clear where to put the Excluded, right?
It could be added as an additional argument to any Col ... function in the formula.
Are there additional paces where it is necessary?
e.g in get rows where,  add

Excluded()[row()]=0

?

shampton82
Level VII

Hey @hogi , sorry i missed your reply!

 

Yeah it can get complicated fast and I've had some frustrating times with it.  That's why a button on the column properties would be a great win for the users.

 

I see you posted something along these same lines as needing to address this issue, maybe we should link our post?

 

Steve

hogi
Level XI

Hi @shampton82 .

 

OK from my side :)

 

For me, some support in handing Excluded States in JSL expressions would be OK, e.g. adding a switch to the right click menu to  add group by excluded automatically to auto-generated col aggregation expressions:
group by excluded() 

This will be soooo helpful - I hope Jmp team will implement it in the next version.

 

In addition: Users should be warned if there are excluded rows and if the Formula doesn't account for that:
https://community.jmp.com/t5/JMP-Wish-List/Formula-Editor-meaningful-results-with-excluded-rows/idc-... 

No user should be "left alone" with wrong result - and nobody telling him that they are wrong.
Many Jmp users are definitely aware of this issue (it#s the FIRST thing which i tell colleagues who start using Jmp) - but I am sure that there are also many users who are not aware

-yet.

 

The checkbox which you describe - wonderful !!!
The only question: Why is it not there already?

I guess that Jmp developers also thought about implementing it - decades ago?

So: Why not?

The easiest solution how it could work: Jmp could treat the data table as if the excluded rows were missing.
Then there is a clear scheme how it reacts if the checkbox is selected.

 

For sure, enabling the checkbox could have severe speed issues - as any row state change will trigger new evaluations.
And for my feeling changing row state settings takes forever!

 

So a checkbox would be exactly the right thing - and perhaps a setting in the preferences where the user can decide if he wants to have the smooth auto-respect-exclude variant or the fast ignore-excluded states enabled by default.

Status changed to: Investigating

Thanks for all the discussion @hogi @shampton82 ! We are reviewing the new information you have added and will update this request once we have prioritized.